Find out how Brendan is pursuing his environmental science dream
Brendan Hart is a Junior Data Analyst in our Melbourne office, working on multiple geospatial projects. A qualified environmental scientist, he was late diagnosed with autism and ADHD (AuDHD) and has faced plenty of challenges throughout his life. Find out more about how he has overcome these below.
Brendan Hart: When I was a kid, we moved every two or three years, including some big interstate moves. I wasn’t that great at making friends. I might have had one or two here and there, but then I had to move and start all over again. Moving around had benefits, as I got to see most of the country, but I was also never really settled. When I was about 10, we moved to Adelaide, and that’s when a whole bunch of bullying started. I never knew why.
“When I was getting bullied, I knew that a move was happening soon. So I used to think I just needed to last these couple of months, and then I’m out of here. It turns out that one mean thing makes big ripples even later in life.”
Eventually, we settled in Wodonga, where I completed my last three years of high school. A large portion of my friend group there was neurodivergent, so we found each other before I knew it! I graduated from high school in 2009. I then moved to Darwin for about a year. It turned out well, as I met one of my best friends there. I then moved back to Wodonga and undertook an environmental science degree at university, specialising in environmental management and ecology. It took me four years to complete a three-year course, but I’m proud that I finished it in 2014. Actually, at ASA, a few of my teammates have an environmental background. A lot of us seem to end up here!
I did some work experience at a catchment management authority while I was still at university, and they were happy to hire me after my placement. But it just took me a little longer to get the degree, and by then, they had budget cuts, so they couldn’t afford to hire me. I then had a six-month stint at the Green Army environmental program. I was undertaking environmental restoration work that was highly physical, and I became ill. I ended up moving back in with my parents to recover. I thought it was just going to be a short-term solution. But it wasn’t. Then, it was a few years of no work at all. The next time I worked was in 2019, and that was a couple of years of working in some pretty terrible places with poor management and broken equipment. I have done maybe six months of work in the environmental field in the past 10 years.
"I always found the job interview process pretty hard. I could never read most interviews properly. I often thought I did well, but a rejection letter would arrive shortly afterwards. I received this feedback once: oh, you’ve been in and out of work for a while, and you’re a bit sad about it, so that’s why we didn’t hire you. That made zero sense to me! You know the solution to that, right?"
It was not helping all the mental health struggles. The only jobs I succeeded in were ones where they were desperate for people. I only worked in fast food, trying to find something more suitable. I just needed something to bring in money, and that’s what my disability support service provider found.
I was only diagnosed with AuDHD recently, in 2021. But I suspected I may have been neurodivergent beforehand. Around 2018, I was at a party, and one of my friends brought up that she was diagnosed as autistic. She asked me if I had considered being assessed. Then the therapist I saw for other things brought it up as well, and then the pandemic hit, and all the extra information and awareness started coming out about it all. I needed the confirmation, so I went and got the diagnosis.
When it was first brought up that it was highly likely that I was autistic, my initial response was, “great, another thing wrong with me”, but that’s not how I view my neurodivergence now. When I saw it on paper, I thought, okay, this explains a lot. I just need to figure out how to deal with it. It’s part of me. It’s part of who I am. It’s like one of those weird metaphors. I was trying to play pool on an ice hockey rink. I’m playing the wrong sport!
One day, while researching the internet for work, I randomly saw an article on Twitter (now X) about ASA’s CEO Geoff Smith. I applied for a Junior Data Analyst role and suddenly had an interview – my first since diagnosis. But I had some drama beforehand, as I was admitted to the emergency room a couple of days before my interview as I had a kidney stone! The interview surprised me because the process was relaxed and conversational. Most of the ones I’ve experienced beforehand were about your response to this or that. Next! This felt more laid back and let me be me. I thought it was hilarious because it usually takes me weeks or months to be comfortable around people, especially if I think I’m seeing someone again.
“My job interview with ASA was the best I’ve ever had. The interview questions were provided beforehand so I could prepare. For neurodivergent people, everything is different for us, including interactions.”
All of a sudden, I had a job! But then the anxiety crept in. I always become nervous when starting something new. I didn’t have that much confidence to begin with, but I did have some background in the applications the geospatial profession is used for. But on the first day, I thought, this place feels right. Since then, I’ve often thought, is this too good to be true? Turns out it hasn’t been! I realised I had been in survival mode for many years before joining ASA. Since I’ve been here, I’ve been working on creating a ‘single source of truth’ for Queensland’s electricity grid. I also had a stint with Acciona, working on a major road project in Melbourne and was embedded in their offices. I’ve definitely learnt a lot in my time here, and there’s so much more I want to know.
It’s so different here from other places that I’ve worked. I’m actually doing something meaningful that has an impact on Australian society. The people around me are so good. Workplaces are defined by the people who work there. Here at ASA, everyone also gives an enormous amount of care. It’s still mind-blowing to me how much they care. If we don’t understand something, there is always someone to help and gain clarity. There are regular check-ins to see how everyone is doing. I like how everything is structured and easy to follow. Everyone wants us to succeed and support us. I’m not just turning up here for a paycheck and going through the motions.
“ASA has improved so many areas of my life. I’m a lot healthier, both mentally and physically. Now, I’ve got an income, and I can budget. I know how much money’s going to bills, what's going to savings – everything. Now that I’m more financially secure, I can afford more things. I have social connections here. The work is very satisfying, too, and my confidence is improving.”
I’ve made some very good friends here at ASA. I enjoy socialising, even just chilling and chatting at lunchtime or after work. It’s so enjoyable. It’s so much better actually having a social life! We often go to the pub after work to socialise. It’s so different from when I was working at the previous places; I was placed in roles like cleaning or delivery driving and only saw coworkers for a few minutes, which felt very isolating.
With communication, before I was diagnosed, I didn’t know why I was hesitant to make eye contact. That probably hindered my job interviews. I’m more likely to be listening to you if I’m not looking at your eyes. It’s tough when someone wants you to look at them while talking. I can either focus by looking away and listening or look at them and not take anything in. I find it hard to do both. But that’s something ASA is helping me with. That’s caused difficulty in the past, as others have said I wasn’t listening, but that’s what I do to focus.
In the past, I’ve had misunderstandings with neurotypical people because I’ve missed social cues, which often happens for neurodivergent people. For example, some people have multiple ways of saying things, and you’re expected to know the unwritten rules. Sometimes, I’ve overthought the message and have replied with something that’s taken the wrong way. That’s why I find direct communication at ASA easy to understand here. For me, I like a mixture of face-to-face and online communication such as email or Teams.
Regarding neurodivergent strengths for myself and my team, pattern recognition is a good one. We pick up on the details, as many of us like picking apart things. What’s good at ASA is that most of us are neurodivergent, so we help each other. Neurotypical people often assume that neurodivergent people are all the same, like the hyper-exaggerated examples you see on TV. I’ve actually heard conversations from neurotypical people, once they’ve got to know us, that we’re effectively ‘normal!’
“We’re people. We’re not robots. We’re not aliens. Some of us just have different formatting in our brains. Some of us struggle with some things, others with different things.”
In terms of what can trigger anxiety for neurodivergent people, many of us hate hearing the phrase ‘we need to talk’. It’s fine to say, ‘don’t forget this’ or ’pay attention’. But starting a message with ‘can we talk?’ creates anxiety. At ASA, I never had a bad meeting with leadership, but still, every time I heard ‘I need to talk to you’, I was worried.
For me, it’s a bit tricky to figure out what exactly triggers anxiety when I’ve just recently figured out that I am twelve anxieties in a trench coat! I have alexithymia, so I’m terrible at understanding or identifying my feelings and emotions because they’re filed so differently! The most common way they are filed is with images that provide a feeling, like standing at the bottom of a cliff, in a cave that suddenly has more space or walking down a mountain full of hidden holes. I’m working on it, and sometimes I just need to feel the feeling and not have to name it.
Regarding what I’d like in the future, I’m now working at Yarra Valley Water in their summer traineeship scheme. ASA helped me land this position by liaising with Yarra Valley Water and supporting the placement, which I’m very grateful for. Eventually, I’d love to work at a catchment management authority or something similar. That was a workplace that I loved. I used my degree there. It was like they’re not the full lab coats, but you’ve got science and the community. I like connecting with them. There are other goals as well, such as having books published. And having a family of my own that’s something I’d love to achieve.